I own a Humming Bird Wide 3D View fish finder (B&W). I purchased the unit 12 years ago for a 12 foot bass boat I own. On the bass boat in fresh water I really like the wide transducer. It shows me 60 feet in either direction and makes it real easy to pick out weed beds. It’s done me real well. 5 years ago a bought a 21 foot walk around. I kept it down in Barnegat bay.  (Avg depth 15 feet max about 30 feet). Water depth is an issue there. I used the same fish finder with the normal (straight down) transducer. I was able to read the bottom 90%-95% of the time while I was moving. Good enough.  I’m finding in the Hudson I lose the bottom 90% of the time when I’m moving in water over 50 feet. Which in the Hudson is 50%-75% of the on the water time. I’m also finding that when I’m doing 25+ Knots I’m loosing way to often. I’m considering getting a new finder. A big part of this is color is a lot easier to read at night. Can anyone recommend a sounder? What should I expect with new technology as far as losing the bottom in the Hudson?

Thanks,

Tom

Tom,

I had a Hummingbird Wide 100. It came with my boat and was the bottom of the line (cheapest) fish finder. I had the same problem on the Hudson. It would lose signal when the boat was moving fast. This year I upgraded to a higher power fish finder. It has a 500 watt transducer. Now I never lose signal. Perhaps your unit is also not too powerful. I have not been fishing though, so I cannot attest to the performance as far as reading fish, but I am expecting that it will do well. All of the manufacturer websites list the specifications of their units, including the output wattage of the transducer. Also, correct positioning of the transducer can have an effect on performance. Make sure your transducer is positioned correctly. Good luck, John

Mark is talking about floating debris in the Hudson hitting the transducer and kicking it up on an angle.  I had gone through a number of transducers that had gotten hit in the Hudson when mounted on the rear transom.

Now I shoot through the hull.  I have never had a problem.  Sensitivity is lost a bit.  I only get readings up to 25 mph but that's fine.  At that speed I am not looking for fish, I am looking for bottom contours.

At over 25 mph I was reading a lot of bubbles anyway when it was mounted on the transom.

I used some epoxy and glued the transducer to a flat spot in the bilge.  Works fine.

The specs for my 1994/5 Wide 3D View are:

Depth Capability – 240 feet

Operating frequency – 455 KHz

Power Output 500 Watts(RMS)

Tom

Make sure that you can adjust the ping speed the faster the speed the faster you can travel on the water and not lose the echos.

Get one with dual tranducer Frequecies, an an adjustble ping speed.

I have a garmin that works well but I believe they are all the same it all depends on personal preference.

Ted   

I'm assuming ping speed is a sensitivity setting. I little digging through the manuals they may reveal a sensitivity setting I can make. HummingBird probably used a less technical term for the setting. What does dual transducer frequencies do?

I have a Garmin 182c GPS that I’m very pleased with. The color GPS is what’s selling me on a color fish finder. I was out at night and the color screen was real easy to read. But what really surprised me this summer was that the color GPS was easier to read than the black and white fish finder in Greenwood Lake.

Tom

Dual frequencies can come in handy.  A low frequency beam usually has a wide angle and can "see" a wider cone under the boat.  It can also punch down deeper but that isn't a big deal in our area.  The high frequency is more sharply focused and used to pick out a little more detail. 

In the diagram the yellow area would be the higer frequency narrow angle beam and the blue would be the low frequency wide angle beam.  You can see more volume of water with the wide beam and would detect two fish in this drawing.  The bottom readout would incorporate all those rocks and some detail would be lost.   The narrow beam would give finer detail of the bottom but only detect one of those fish. 

If you have to choose pick both.

Quote: Originally posted by Fred R on September/16/2005

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Dual frequencies can come in handy.  A low frequency beam usually has a wide angle and can "see" a wider cone under the boat.  It can also punch down deeper but that isn't a big deal in our area.  The high frequency is more sharply focused and used to pick out a little more detail. 

In the diagram the yellow area would be the higer frequency narrow angle beam and the blue would be the low frequency wide angle beam.  You can see more volume of water with the wide beam and would detect two fish in this drawing.  The bottom readout would incorporate all those rocks and some detail would be lost.   The narrow beam would give finer detail of the bottom but only detect one of those fish. 

If you have to choose pick both.

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Yes you would detect two fish but they would show up at the far right of the screen and you would have no idea where they are other than within a 60ft radius around the boat.  I really don't like those wide angle things because you see 'blips" going off all over and don't really know where they are.  Also, the wide angle beem does not read the bottom, only the narrow beam does.

I use my fishfinder for safety and that's about it.  I find them pretty useless for finding fish and even marking structure.  What you see on the screen has little to do w/ the shape of the bottom.  Depending on how fast you are going and how fast the screen is moving - what you are really seeing is a small "slice" of what you just passed over.  One of these days someone is going to make a real-time 3d renderer of the bottom that will present a real picture of what the bottom looks like.

sm

One of these days someone is going to make a real-time 3d renderer of the bottom that will present a real picture of what the bottom looks like.

sm

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Now this is what I'm talking about .....the Interphase Probe.

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Working like an underwater radar, the Probe scans a moving beam vertically from just below the surface to directly beneath your boat to show 'live action' views of changing bottom contours, structure obstructions and schools of fish ahead of your boat. In addition, the Probe operates with a full function downward looking mode for conventional fishfinding action. Looking 1200 feet ahead of your bow and down to 640' below the keel, the Probe gives you a clear view of the entire water column ahead of and below your boat.

http://www.eangler.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10701&catalogId=10051&langId=-1&productId=3192532&bct=t13004454%3Bc249089

Check this one out.  I'm not a Humminbird fan by any means, but the 3D view is pretty cool.

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/standard-pod.jsp?rid=&indexId=cat21396&navAction=push&navCount=1&cmCat=MainCatcat21276&parentType=index&parentId=cat21396&id=0031105

That's pretty cool, but it looks like that unit is doing what other traditional FF are doing - recording a log of changes that pass under the boat.  So for example, if you put the boat in reverse - the items behind you would not start coming back, but would continue to pass from right to left.  I'm pretty sure that this Interphase produce would.

The Interphase units take a snapshot of what is in front of the boat and scan either horizontally or vertically.  They use a phased array that is similar to an ultrasound device in the doctor's office.  They also look straight down to give you the normal fish finder view.

One problem with them is that in shallow water the signal going out from your boat will bounce back from the bottom and you will only be able to see ahead a distance of 6 times the depth of the water.  So in 30 feet of water you will see 180 feet ahead of the boat.

They work nice offshore and pick out the dropoffs that face towards your boat but in shallow water and for dropoffs that fall away from your boat they aren't that much better than a normal fish finder.

The 47 is similar to the Wide 3D View that I have. In water that I’m not familiar with it makes understanding the bottom contour easier. Really what I’m looking for is a color version of the 47. But I don’t need a screen as large as my wide screen TV at home. My Hummingbird Wide 3D can also accommodate what they called a side transducer. It sends out a signal 60 feet off either side of the boat. I don’t use it in the Hudson, but it’s real helpful for fresh water fishing. I use it to locate weed beds.  

Now that makes sense. I'll check it when the rain stops.

Thanks,

Tom

I checked it and it’s on solid. This is getting real frustrating. I’ve never had a transducer go before. Do they normally just stop working or do they fade away?

Tom

Many times a finder  will stop working at higher speeds when a bubble forms underneath the transducer.  There could be a number of reasons for that to happen.  The angle of the lower surface needs to face slightly forward.  If that angle changes the transducer may lose contact with the water and not be able to send or receive any echo.  There could be something causing turbulence in the water as it goes past the transducer.  Check the hull forward of the transducer for any barnacles etc. and check the transducer itself for any fouling or damage.

If the transducer doesn't seem to be the problem there are any sensitivity adjustments you can make in the unit itself.  Try playing with those.

 I have an Apelco finder that must be 15 years or more old.  There have been numerous times that this has happened on both boats I mounted it on.  Whenever it loses signal at speed an adjustment of the angle of the transducer has always made it come back.    Even though the bolts were tight I loosened them and adjusted the angle slightly forward.  It made a big difference.   The speed sensing paddle wheel has long ago broken off but it still gives me a good signal at pretty much any speed.  I have had finders go bad from water intrusion but I haven't had any transducers wear out.  I'm not saying that they can't go bad but even if you wanted to replace it where are you going to find another one? 

Good luck.

I’m going to play with this a little in the spring. Or I’ll see what Santa brings. Maybe a new color finder that will interface with my GPS (Ho, Ho, Ho). The unit has a diagnostic mode that I can do some testing. On the bubbles and barnacles  theory: in 2003 I purchased a trailer an stopped keeping the boat in the water. I spoke with a fiberglass repair person in 2002 and he stated that on a 10 year old boat, that gets bottom painted every year, has between 200 and 400 pounds of bottom paint on the boat. He stated that this is based on his experience on what has to be disposed of when he strips a 21’-23’ boat down to the gelco.  This is like having an extra person or two onboard. Since the boat is now trailered and does not need to be bottom painted, I’ve been letting the paint flake off. I’ve actually been encouraging it when I wash the hull after each use with a hose. The further forward you look, the more paint has come off. A fair amount has actually come off the bow. I’m wondering if this could be the culprit.  Bubbles.

 Tom